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What is the true reality of being "clean"?


clean
and
serene
What is the true reality of being "clean"
I ask this question because some of my defects of character still pop up and when they do I run with them. I do it because at the time it feels good but after the intentional "high" it gives I feel like $hit, Guilty, and asking myself why. I know something could be wrong or hurt someone I love but I have done it anyways. Has this happened with anyone else? I would like some input on the following things that I have seen in others and I ask myself are they clean doing these things? Am I clean when I go off the deep end with my thinking or my defects of character? Everyone please fill me in if you can. Thank you.
Are you clean if you use something besides meth?
Are you clean if you lie?
Are you clean if you cheat on a spouse or loved one?
Are you clean if you steal at the store?
Are you clean if you just don't use anything but still do the same $hit you did while using?
Are you clean if your thoughts are all Fu*@ed up?
Are you clean if your still full of resentment?
Are you clean if your still full of fear?
Are you clean if your still full of self pity, or self seeking motives?

Any feedback is appreciated.

Thank you
     Replies...
Rachel
sue76
Re: What is the true reality of being "clean"
Quote:
Are you clean if you use something besides meth?
Clean from meth- yes. Clean from whatever you used - no. If you go with N.A. you are not clean.
 
Quote:
Are you clean if you lie?
Someone who lies is a liar. Irregardless of using or not. There are plenty of people that have never used meth that are habitual liars.
Quote:
Are you clean if you cheat on a spouse or loved one?
Best to get that checked out at the health department
Quote:
Are you clean if you steal at the store?
Once again, there are plenty of people that have problems with stealing that have nothing to do whatsoever with meth.
Quote:
Are you clean if you just don't use anything but still do the same $hit you did while using?
Maybe it is time to work on changing those things that you have done so often while using that they have become your habits. Time to master your habits or they will master you.
Quote:
Are you clean if your thoughts are all Fuked up?
This is not to make light of your questions but what are "normal" thoughts? My version of fuked up and your version of fuked up could be totally different.
 
Quote:
Are you clean if your still full of resentment?
I would say that you are just full of resentment and need to work on letting go.
Quote:
Are you clean if your still full of fear?
You are changing your way of life. Change is sometimes scary. I would feel pretty scared if my whole way of life had to start changing today.
Quote:
Are you clean if your still full of self pity, or self seeking motives?
Self-pity does us no good. Yeah so what? You fuked up. You can either sit around and feel sorry for your self or you can forgive yourself for not being perfect and go on.

JMHO.
Penel0pe Re: What is the true reality of being "clean"
Quote:
Are you clean if you use something besides meth?
My opinion? NO, you're not...

Now, someone may jump in here to remind me that I am taking medication for pain... but trust me, I am not "USING" in any sense of the word. There is nothing enjoyable about being in a stupor, half asleep, or depressed for me. I find PAIN to be even less enjoyable, so the meds are the lesser of two evils. (FYI - out of 50 pills I picked up on the 30th, the doctor wrote "Must last 8 days" on the script. I still have 34 pills left. I counted em this morning just to "Check Myself so I don't Wreck myself...  )
Quote:
Are you clean if you lie?
Are you clean if you cheat on a spouse or loved one?
Are you clean if you steal at the store?
Are you clean if you just don't use anything but still do the same $hit you did while using?
Are you clean if your thoughts are all Fuked up?
Are you clean if your still full of resentment?
Are you clean if your still full of fear?
Are you clean if your still full of self pity, or self seeking motives?
 
You might be clean, but you sure aren't recovering.

Good to see you here
Hemet
chik
Re: What is the true reality of being "clean"
Pen...that is where na and sponsor do you good...cause I know for a fact...if I had those pills...they would not have lasted me 5 days ...your in recovery...your doing FREAKING great...dont let NOBODY LET YOU THINK DIFFERENTLY...your my her
Was
Tweaked
Re: What is the true reality of being "clean"
Clean is different for each person. For me it is being clean from the drug that has produced problems in my life, meth.
For me I am clean.
forget
suzette
Re: What is the true reality of being "clean"
Clean..
...this is among the best you've ever posted.
*hugs* very kewl.


Are you clean if you use something besides meth?

yes/no

YES, you are clean from meth,
........but NO you're not clean from whatever else you are using.

Are you clean if you lie?

... YES, but then, you're a liar.

Are you clean if you cheat on a spouse or loved one?

NO, definately DIRTY!
j/k

yes, but you are a snake.

Are you clean if you steal at the store?

Yes...but you'd be a theif.
Are you clean if you just don't use anything but still do the same $hit you did while using?

yes, but you'd have real issues if you act like me on speed.
.......you'd seek theropy.


(these questions here really applied to me most, this was thought provoking TY)...

Are you clean if your thoughts are all Fuked up?

I'm clean, my thoughts are fuked up,I wanna go back to drugs.

Are you clean if your still full of resentment?

yes, I'm clean, I'm full of resentment, of being sober, and I wanna go back to drugs

Are you clean if your still full of fear?

yes,I'm clean, I'm full of fear, that I can't make it here, the demon howls, and I wanna go back to drugs
Are you clean if your still full of self pity, or self seeking motives?

yes,I wanna feel good I'm worthless it got the best of me.... but I wanna go back to drugs.

clean...
....that's the reasons it all weighs so heavy on me...
you listed em.

thank you for that..
..it helps something, like, if i can name the problems I can whine to my shrink...or think about it.

DISCLAIMER:

you guys..
...I'm not as depressed as that read,it was just the subject we were discussing.
.............I feel that way all the time.
like a dull ache
.......I'm in not where I can get to drugs.
I'm in no danger.


.........right now.
chris
gonz
Re: What is the true reality of being "clean"
For me...
when I decided to get clean, it meant...

Not doing any kind of dope, I smoke pot off and on. Sometimes I'll go years without smoking weed, then sometimes I feel like a toke. Just being honest. So as far as drugs go, I stay away from pills and anything that can go into a rig.

Staying away from the drug world. Active users I only deal with on forums. I don't want to be around users because I know they can hook me up. Dealers are as bad as users in my book, I stay away from them too, even if they're family.

Working honestly, making honest money.

Keeping the drug world out of my home and away from my children.

That's what being clean means to me and for me.
We all live different lives and come from different walks, so what works for me may or may not work for others.

This is JMHO
imlost
inky
Re: What is the true reality of being "clean"
Clean, ditto what all said.

My husband is clean from meth - working on letting go of the beer and pot. Doing better.

Would do a lot better if he didn't feel fuked up - if he didn't feel damaged- if he didn't have fear that he may never feel alive again.

It's been over a year and the best day he has ever had is just a glimpse Clean. That is all the happiness he gets- glimpses. Moments. never lasting more than a few moments.

Here he is, giving it his all, I promised him it would get better, that there is life after meth- and he is finding the life after meth lacking.
Because he is damaged.

The experts say within 18 months most meth users have regained 80% of their dopamine back.
I am hoping and praying that my husband is in the most, and that the 80% is enough to help him feel alive.

It hasn't happened yet- but I am still hoping.

Me? Clean, I guess I just got lucky all the way around.
I don't steal, I don't lie, I don't cheat, I don't use anything and I find life to be just that -life.
80% is more than enough for me to feel real.
I hit into the most category.
For me, there most certainly is life after meth- even if times I feel fuked up and stupid and all the other insecure feelings there are to have.
The times I don't feel fuked up outnumber the times I do.
cleanand
serene
Re: What is the true reality of being "clean"
80% would be great. I am no "expert" but I have fasr less then that. Thnaks for the imput.
imlost
inky
Re: What is the true reality of being "clean"
I hear ya Clean. So does my husband- he has just enough that once in a blue moon he actually feels good for a few moments.
Glimpses Clean- just enough to know what he is missing and mourn for the loss.
80% would be nice.It sure would
He wants so bad to feel as he did before this last run.
Just to be excited about something- to look forward to something. Just to just feel alive.
He used to get so psyched up about having the weekend off, fishing trips, hanging out and grilling out-
It doesn't happen anymore. Everyday is just another day of nothing.

How long have you been clean now? He is working on 15 months with a few days here or there, less than 5 that he used.
I wonder if it has to be a straight 18 months of no use at all?
clean
and
serene
Re: What is the true reality of being "clean"
I havent had a drink or a drug for 3 years on 4/16 God willing. I used to have bad years but now at least I only have bad days. I have to remind myself of this. I know I have alot of work to do with myself. This is a fact. I also know that God loves me and wants me to make mistakes so I can learn from them. I need to stay focused on my recovery and not get off into morbid thought or reflection to much when I do that I can all fuked up with self. I miss this bored at times and the friends I have or had here. I guess what I was looking for was just an honest opinion on if others have slipped back into old thinking or actions from time to time? How do we get out of it once we do? Why is it so easy to hate oneself at times in order to cope with what life hands us? Why can I get so down on myself at times and like the feeling it gives me? Then as soon as it comes one day I just snap out of it and slap myself in the face and say get grateful stupid. Your in the right place and you are human.
Sunshine
state
Re: What is the true reality of being "clean"
I think what you said makes perfect sense and i am glad someone understands that. I slipped backwards recently on something but because of all of the years of experiences i had finally picked it up faster that something was wrong and stopped as fast as i could when i realized i had made such a major mistake. I do wish however i could take a lot of things back that i had done. i have many regrets but life is going on no matter what so either way i am covered.Thank you
imlos
tinky
Re: What is the true reality of being "clean"
Quote:
How do we get out of it once we do?
Clean, for me it is a daily thing.First thing every day, the serenity prayer. Next thought is how very blessed I truly am.
My mind goes where I allow it to go.
I have a choice every day- I can waste it on regrets and self pity and not being satisfied for what I have accomplished
Or
I can appreciate it for the gift that is - remind myself of how very much I am loved- and how very wonderful it is to give love.
I try to catch every sunrise- I try to watch every sunset.
Every day is a miracle Clean.

I make that choice every day to be the very best me I can be.
clean
and
serene
Re: What is the true reality of being "clean"
do I have to be responsible for my thoughts and my actions at the same time? hummmmm
imlost
inky
Re: What is the true reality of being "clean"
I don't act until I have thought  Period.
Even if I look stupid just standing there.
Trust me, it is better that way LOL!
For me the impulsiveness is a kicker. Snap decisions don't work well for me.
I have to think first.

Honestly Clean, I get my mind straight before I move.
If it takes an hour then it takes an hour.
I just do the best I can do for that day.It may or may not equal to past days.
For me Clean, it isn't so important what others think or feel about me- it is how I feel about me.
What I try to do each day is make someone ,anyone smile- just make their day easier.
You know, I do that just by telling the cashier thank you.
I do that just by opening a door for someone whose hands are full.
Just telling my kids come here ,let me give you a hug- Hey you did a good job there-
Clean, it is so easy to do. And it makes me feel the best.
At the end of the day I evaluate myself.
What did I do good? Did I miss a chance to let someone know how much I care?
Next day begin again.
I do my best on days when I just stop and think.
It is those days when I get caught up in the routine that I forget what life is.
angie
Ncali
Re: What is the true reality of being "clean"
My take on this is – If I use anything I am NOT CLEAN. For anyone who is in a program …… this is true.


As far as @#%$ up thoughts – thoughts are just that – thoughts. Just because we get sober and maybe even work powerful life changing programs – it doesn’t mean all of our thoughts will change. My head is still my head … and it might always be out to get me.

As far as all of those other things you asked about, lying, stealing, cheating, carrying on with the same behavior we did while using etc etc etc …are you clean. YES.

As long as you don’t put any mood or mind altering drugs/alcohol in your body … in an abusive way ( I am not talking about nicotine, or caffeine or someone who is taking pain meds exactly as they have been prescribed by a medical doctor ) then you are clean.

But my take on people who do these things is that they are in their disease. If I were to start stealing from stores , or cheating, or lying on continual basis – something inside me would be wrong – I would probably be spiritually sick whether I realized it or not. And I would attempt to try and fill that hole up inside of me by doing these things looking for that ease and comfort – and when I am relying on filling up that hole with destructive behavior –I only end up making that hole bigger – meaning I have to do more lying and stealing or cheating or all of the above …. Which in the end will start to make me not feel good about myself (whether I realize it or not) all these things are symptoms of my disease- the real problem is me …. And eventually while I am busy trying to fill this ever growing hole up with more of this and more of that – but yet still not using … but
ABSOLUTELY in my DISEASE – it is only a matter of time before I probably do end up turning to what I know best. And for me that is meth. Because now I have this hole that I can’t seem to fill …. And since I can’t fill it …. I will probably need something to numb it - ----

Anyways I could go on and on and on.

Are you clean yes…. Are you recovering still … probably Not.
angie
Ncali
Re: What is the true reality of being "clean"
Quote:
guess what I was looking for was just an honest opinion on if others have slipped back into old thinking or actions from time to time? How do we get out of it once we do? Why is it so easy to hate oneself at times in order to cope with what life hands us?
I just read this ! Yes I have slipped back into some old unhealthy behaviors. And it resulted in me ending up in this gut wretching pain. It just hurt to breathe AGAIN. Which is exactly how it felt right before I got sober. I just hurt inside out. -

I broke down in the shower Bawling my eyes out. I got out got on my knees and prayed. I really hadnt been doing much in my program. Tried to experiment and see If I could still go about life and still be okay.

I WASN'T. Also started lying and hanging out with other people who were doing things they shouldnt have been doing ..... It HURT - BAD.

I told a friend - realized I was probably in relapse mode .... weighed out my options ... I could either go on feeling like I was and end up getting loaded ... ( WHICH SCARED THE HELL OUT OF ME) or I could step up my program and double up on everything I knew I should be doing.

How or Why this worked I dont know. But it did.

I need to take care of my spirit. At all costs.

Morning meditation (even when I think i am too busy or dont wanna do it) I do it.

Doing something nice for someone and not taking any credit for it

working with new comers.

reading my big book.

Volunteering.

getting active with commitments at meetings

All sorts of things.

LOTS OF CONTRARY ACTION ... in the end ...

You'll see the difference
chris
gonz
Re: What is the true reality of being "clean"
I don't drink, lie, cheat, or steal..

I did when I was using speed/dope.

I don't do that with weed. I also have a prescription and a certificate for it. So.. hmmmm..

Also, I never did NA, I honestly don't like group therapy, but do believe in programming, even if it's 12 steps. Just happens I'm not interested in NA. I do see how NA works for others and hey, whatever works.

I prefer self-help literature, therapy one-on-one, living honestly, being kind, being aware of how my actions effect people in general, staying healthy as possible and addressing my issues as they arise.

That's what works for me.

I don't fit into a category where I have to follow a way of life because it's written down. I believe I should follow a way of life because it's what I believe to be right in my heart and my biggest concern in regards to my person is that I have a good soul by the time I croak.

Ultimately, I think the goal should be to be happy. Really happy with your life.

I love my life, I like me, I still deal with bouts of depression, but life for me will go on until it stops.

My way I think about things is MUCH different than when I used drugs without prescriptions.

That's just me though.
clean
and
serene
Re: What is the true reality of being "clean"
Angie and Imlostinky thank you very much. I needed to hear these things. Everyone else with imput here as well thanks a million

But still if my thoughts are bad I mean real bad and my actions are still good will that ever change?

How about rationazation? Well I don't do this anymore but I do this instead. I have seen this in myself and in others recently. What do you think of this?


I also must say that this bored has more recovering addicts these days very nice  Good to get a good mixture.


Any normies out there that have exibited strange behavior to make there selves feel good but realized it was wrong because it hurt someone else or themselves in the long run???

What is cheating to you? I mean is cyber sex cheating? Is flirting cheating? Is looking cheating? Is fantasy cheating?

What is lying to you?
Streching the truth? Not telling somebody something?


When is telling somebody something to much? I mean if you know it might hurt them when do you just not say it?

Just wanna see where other peoples minds are on this stuff.
imlost
inky
Re: What is the true reality of being "clean"
Clean, cheating to me is anything or anyone that takes from the intimacy of my marriage.
Plain and simple.
My husband did not sexually cheat on me- true.But he did cheat on me when others knew more about him, his day, his thoughts than I did.
When he shared so much of his life with everyone but me.
When I was left out and clueless.
It is more than just sex to me in regards to cheating.
It is that which diminishes our relationship.

Clean, I am not a nice person.really I am not.
More often than not a smarta** remark comes to mind first.
Some people are just naturally nice.
I am not. I know that. I work on it daily.
By nature I am a suspicious person. I don't trust. I hold people at arm's distance.
I know that too.

Will I ever change? I don't know - I just know I keep trying because I truly would like to be a nice person.
I truly would like to be able to trust.
I would like to get close to others- know them and have them know me.

Bad thoughts to me do not make a bad person.
Often though the bad thoughts stay around much longer than they need be if I were to be open and honest and intimate with the one closest to me.
I'm working on it.

rationalization- Yeah, I do it.
Sometimes it is a necessary thing for me to find one thing good about me for that day.
Well I am still closed off, I am still not nice, BUT ....
when my son smarted off to me, I kept my cool .....

I rationalize when I say I garden instead....
I rationalize when I don't do things I really needed to do...
I rationalize when I take my Ltyrosine and I get for a moment a speedy feel and I like it, I really do.
I rationalize when I pop an advil cold and sinus and get for a moment that speedy feel.....

Later, when I am strong enough to handle the real truth, I face it.
Then I work on it- on days I can take that brutal honesty with myself.
Sometimes the brutal truth is just more than I can take on a really bad day.

Lying-
I don't. if it comes out of my mouth , if I type it on paper, even here then it is the truth.

I don't always say everything I am thinking. I really don't think that I should all the time.
Somethings are best left unsaid.

And I can give my husband that privacy- EXCEPT when it jeopardizes our relationship.
When it jeopardizes his sobriety.
or when I am wearing something that really doesn't look good on me........please tell me.

Clean, I don't expect perfection. I don't expect to agree with everyone and have everyone agree with me.
To me if everybody is saying yes I agree then somewhere someone is lying.
I know that I may not ever be the person I would like most to be- just good.Just a really kind good person that always sees the best in this world.
But that doesn't stop me from trying.
forget
suzette
Re: What is the true reality of being "clean"
if my thoughts are bad I mean real bad and my actions are still good will that ever change?

Good question, I'm in the same boat you are.

How about rationazation? ...what's that?

Well I don't do this anymore but I do this instead.

.....I don't do meth, I do adderrall.
it's an improvement.
I have seen this in myself and in others recently. What do you think of this?

A persons goal should be to see how much they can live without, not how many habits can you aquire.
.....I lost the game, but i thought the rules were differrent, and the penalty so severe.

....if I was stuck in an elevater with you....
in a brown out....I'm on lexipro, adderrall, xannx, and I smoke.


I'm crazy as hell.
....it would be better to be with a regular person who was happy without anything, with a functional brain.


who's richer?
...a man with all the money in the world to buy drugs.

or the guy who does'nt need anything.
...but air water clothing shelter.

I'm an addict tho.
.....too late for me.

What is cheating to you?

decieving.
....sneaking,betrayals,lies,alibis,suspician,gnawing.
maniplulation, acting like you are one thing, and you are another....wearing a mask.
...going in for the kill, in disregard for fairplay.


I mean is cyber sex cheating?

not if you let you mate read it.... Is flirting cheating?

not if you are tag teaming with your mate..
flamboyantly maybe, but eye contact, a smile and a nod, that's regular being allowed to be yourself in peace.

... Is looking cheating?

I draw people, so I look, but not stare, flamboyantly...it's tacky, and disrespectful especilly if the S.O. is present.

..it's like farting on a friend, it's uncalled for.

Is fantasy cheating? ...Hell no!  ...Gawd!*smiles*
...give people their damn dreams! ..if they have one.


What is lying to you? ...not truth as you know it.
Streching the truth?
.....exaggerrating details of the truth
Not telling somebody something?

.....it depends on if you are gonna say,

"your ass looks fat" ....or "I'm hocking the VCR cause I spent the rent money on speed"

....sometimes the truth is best left alone.

However,you have to arm your S.O. with information she might need to be on guard for.
....the truth has a way of coming out, so you may as well be the person to tell em.

people need to know everything that's coming to bob, and weave, and try to work together against the EXTERNAL forces.
...not INTERNAL.

........you gotta pick a partner and BE a partner
When is telling somebody something to much? I mean if you know it might hurt them when do you just not say it?

like me not telling my mother I was fantasizing about trading sex for meth?


....she don't need to know that, to know ME and my ordeal.
I'm not telling her what I know would hurt her more.
.....she knows what happened.
Sunshine
state
Re: What is the true reality of being "clean"
Hello Clean,
You gave some good info earlier. I hope this gives you some insight on your question about lies and truth. To me and this is just a matter of opinion, When you lie to yourself about who you are and your true feelings you are depriving yourself the true opportunity to see the gifts and potential that God has given you and as for truth. If you know when something is right for you as long as it is not life threating to yourself or others then it is probably something you are meant to do. When you deny yourself what you know in your heart is truly right for you then you are cheating yourself and others from having what you know is right for you in the first place and them as well for fullfilling their destinies. Now this may seem somewhat confusing but read it a few times and then it will come together. i had relationships where people have cheated on me. it was hurtful then but what i realized later is that it was a blessing in disguise some of the people found the people they were truly meant for and yes it hurt at the time however when my time comes for me to find someone good then i know i will appreciate it, all of the little and big things alike. I hope this helps you this is all a matter of opinion but if you know you are where you are meant to be try what you can to stick with it and only if it is for one purpose alone LOVE **** not for money, sex,or convienience because that is a good way to ruin your self esteem and the other person's when you could be spending your lifetime with someone you know you are meant for and know that you will share a balance with even if it takes a lot of work. Also relationships in general have ups and downs at times but like i said if you are not feeling it then there is a good possibility that you are not meant to be there but if you are and it is just an issue, you guys can pair up and work it out and as my ex-fiance would say try a lot of prayers and time at the park where you can smell the roses because that is a great place so do speak. And by the way the situations are not always in the plans of what man tells you it is . Sometimes God tends to switch it up so when you do have what you desire in life. You will appreciate it all of the more. Well Good night and until another time and i know this is an oddball answer but like is said read it a few times and then it will come to you.

 

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