Keeping the police out of family meth problems

When I read the posts, it seems that not many folks get the law invovled when a family is screwed up on meth.

Why is this?

Do you realize that when it comes down to it, eventually the law has it's hand in it and this MAY save your son, daughter, mom, dad? When it's not up to you or them anymore at least you've bought some time to MAYBE make them WAKE UP!!!

I immediately started filing reports when my kid started running away to go party, took her to the sheriff's dept when I caught her shoplifting, and I will not hesitate to get the law involved when I find that she's using again. A Paper trail is a great tool for getting results! Until there was enough, I wasn't offered any help from social services or otherwise. Funny...my taxes pay for this!!! Now we're hopefully on the mend!

These people, (meth users), need to be held accountable for what they do. Let someone else who is qualified take a stand. Us parents CANNOT do this all on our own! At least they can be made to try recovery. At least they can be made to put their children in a safer environment!

I'm glad I don't tolerate this stuff very much. I may not be getting the results I want but at least I'm getting help because I could in no way do this on my own! Getting others involved has been the only way...

Honestly I'm very happy for you that this approach has worked for you. I don't think it fits every situation but maybe I'm just too biased since I'm seeing it from the addicts perspective.

I'm very hesitant to involve the law in these situations.. in part because I know for some people it feels like a serious breach of trust to be turned in by your familly. I know that I would not have been comfortable staying at my moms house if she had ever turned me in... but then, I wasnt living with her and I wasn't a minor.

I do agree with you though that in cases involving minors the law is a powerfull tool to show an addict the realities and consequences of their use.

Just my thoughts.

There is no trust when to comes to meth...on either side.

I started with social services, kept the law out. I had to real reason to involve the law. (addict is hubby, not child)

Social services has a variety of programs designed to help families in many, many different situations and we are just too afraid to call and ask. Their job is NOT to remove children from homes, but to work with families to better home situations.

I admitted to social workers that I broke windows and glass objects in our home and that I drank every night and my child was not removed.

That is the case in your situation and I understand and respect that. My own situation was different.. and so I wrote what I did because I think there are some situations where involving the law is a poor choice.

Like I said.. I think that if the situation involves a minor especially one living at home involving the law is a good idea...

If my mom had turned me in.. the police would have raided where I was living at the time. I would have been arrested for manufacturing, possesion of a stolen illigal firearm, distribution/sales, possesion of stolen property with weapon enhancements and possibly gang enhancements if they managed to make those stick. I would still be in prison.. and I would never have trusted my mother again.

My recovery was really made possible because I trusted my mom... they only released me from jail last time because my mom was willing to have me released into her custody. Had we not trusted eachother I would have been released onto the streets again and gone back to making money the only way I knew how. After all, thats what I had done for the past couple years at that point.

There was trust between my mother and I. I never stole from her once and she allowed me to come by her house to eat dinner occaisionally so we saw eachother... and I trusted her to know where I was staying and stayed in contact with her trusting her not to have me busted.

Different situations are different. Like I said.. I fully believe that you've made good descisions given the situation you are in. I just wanted to point out the other side.

I wish someone had turned myself and my husband in. I wish someone had called CPS on behalf of our children. It could have prevented alot of suffering. There are bad cops, but there alot more bad dope heads. My husband went to jail and cried to get out after two weeks (he had suffered enough, learned his lesson, ect.). His family got him out and he went back to doping that same night. If they had left him for six months he might have had a chance to get his head clean, maybe not. But, at least it would've been a chance. He wishes that he had been left in jail and that I had called the law many times now that he is sober and he tells everyone so.

In my situation I really think I had no other choice.

He was going to die.

He was probably going to die in my house.

If not die, get caught in my house and I would go down with him.

In a sense, I guess it was him or me.

I didn't do it to "make him get clean". I look at it now as I "made him get his f'in head on straight" so he could decide if that's how he really wants to live.

When he gets out, it's up to him what he does. A fresh start.

hi, this is my frist post i needed to tell ya my feeling on this subject. my daughter is a meth addict for many years, i am also in na and aa for 10 plus years,i am so glad it was not around when i was using. i have guardenship of my two grand-kids,evited there mom and dad.and went to the law with information , i get sick wondering if she will be alive tomorrow, a moms nigth mare,if she is in jail maybe she will be here someday to raise her own kids.i am for now raising them, hopefully she will get it.by the grace of god, i do attend naranon and it helps to know theres others out there with a common problem. also in the serenity it says the courage to change the things i can abd the wisdom to know the difference.i have prayed for years i needed to get busy. i also pray some day she will thank me, for now she can not do it herself

Hi Jacksmom.

I hope this finds you well, and Jacquelyn jumping through the hoops of her many new obligations.
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At least they can be made to try recovery.

I have to say, I disagree with this statement. You cannot shove recovery down an addict's throat. It just doesn't work, and frankly, I think it's a waste of tax dollars. My tax dollars, as I have worked non-stop since I was 15.

Recovery is a choice, just as using is. It cannot be had unless the addict voluntarily submits to it.
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At least they can be made to put their children in a safer environment!

I do, however, agree with you here. It is our responsbility as a society to protect the children of our society, no matter whose children they are. Meth addicts are, usually, horrible parents. Some worse than others.
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These people, (meth users), need to be held accountable for what they do.

I'm having a little trouble with this comment, but that's probably because I was a meth addict. I don't know what you mean when you say this. Are you saying they should be forced into rehab? If so, I have addressed that above. Are you saying they should be thrown in jail? Jail does nothing but clear their heads, get them fed and cleaned up, and then sends them right back out to their addiction. It teaches them nothing.

I applaud every effort you have made on behalf of Jacquelyn, and I am glad that you have enlisted help from whatever agencies are helping you. I do wish the best for you and Jack, and thanks for keeping us up to date on her.

I did not involved the law until recently. For me, I have worked with many cops in my profession. Now, that I have reached out, I have found comfort and understanding and with hope that my daughter will hit rock bottom as far as the law issue is concerned. Today, I took my grandson out of the picture. Now, I have to take her out as well. I have found that forcing her into anything just causes resentment and hate towards me. However, this is a chance I am going to take now. I hope to save her life and mine.

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Jacksmom’s quote
Do you realize that when it comes down to it, eventually the law has it's hand in it and this MAY save your son, daughter, mom, dad? When it's not up to you or them anymore at least you've bought some time to MAYBE make them WAKE UP!!!
I may not be getting the results I want but at least I'm getting help because I could in no way do this on my own!

Jacksmom,        I hear you loud and clear. My son got HIMSELF in jail in July-05. While he was in jail, with tears in his eyes, he told me he wanted to go to NA, Church and go back to work. I believe he meant it then, still do today. Later, he also asked if we would agree to a third party release (My wife and I would be the third party) I let him stay in jail for around 2 weeks then presented his plan to the Judge. The judge is was a childhood friend of my wife and let my son out of jail. He did very well for around 2 weeks then started lying about going to NA meeting. I had told my son that if he did not live up to HIS agreement that I would tell the judge. I informed the judge in September and they picked him up on October 28, 2005. He will be in there for a minimum of 38 days maybe more. I am not going to get him out.

I agree with Nineyearsclean that “Recovery is a choice, just as using is. It cannot be had unless the addict voluntarily submits to it.” And “Jail does nothing but clear their heads, get them fed and cleaned up, and then sends them right back out to their addiction. It teaches them nothing.”

However, I am hoping that the time in jail will clear his head and maybe HE will decide that he wants recovery. I believe that God can use anything to help an addict get clean, even jail.
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Spacemonkey’s quote
If my mom had turned me in.. the police would have raided where I was living at the time. I would have been arrested for manufacturing, possession of a stolen illegal firearm, distribution/sales, possession of stolen property with weapon enhancements and possibly gang enhancements if they managed to make those stick. I would still be in prison.. and I would never have trusted my mother again.

Spacemonkey, Do you have an answer for Jacksmom and I as to how our children can get clean?
Have you seen your child’s face bleed for three days because he was beaten by three men in the free meth world? Have you seen your child’s dreams disappear and turn to shyt? Do you think there is any hope for a meth addict to get into long term recovery without any suffering?
I turned my son in out of pure love; it sure was not a betrayal of trust. If he does not trust me because I turned him in then his head is still screwed up. I do not know if you understand Jacksmom and I; our souls have been shaken to the roots because of what this drug is doing to our children and we are desperate for anyone to help them. I hope you would not judge your mom as untrustworthy in the event she ever turns you in. She would only do that out of pure love because when a parent turns their child into the justice system their heart hurts for a long time.

I am so glad that you are clean and that your mother did the right thing for you. Give her a hug every time you see her. Your mom, Jacksmom, and I will do anything to help get our children’s soul back away from the meth monster. It is not a betrayal of trust for a parent to turn to the justice system when nothing else is working. God works in mysterious ways.

Spacemonkey, I have read a lot of your posts and think that you add a lot to this board but I just disagree with your parent/jail/trust position regarding your mom.

Sept 26,2003 I evicted my daughter & b/f,called CPS, called the cops! At that time I did not call the cops to turn daughter & co. in but to ask for any help/advice they could give me,and to request them to come inspect my home for meth lab equipment! I was lucky to get a Narcotics Sheriff's officer that cared,cared about my daughter & her child. He was there for me for the whole time daughter on the streets! He gave me a lot of support, and kind of kept an eye on her for me.
I did call the city police when daughter stole from me, she left me no other choice! At times I had to call police to remove daughter & b/f, they were high at the time, police did nothing!
If my daughter had "trusted" me like Spacemonkey says she trusted her mom,I maybe would have "trusted" her. All my daughter did to me was lie, cheat, & use me.....emotionally ,financially!
My daughter is in recovery now,over 100 days,and we are putting our relationship back together rather nicely.I learned here that I was not dealing with my daughter but her addiction. I didn't call the cops on my daughter,I called on her addiction!

sdmsanjose,

I think I must not have been clear enough in what I wrote. I do not judge you or any parent(or anyone) as having betrayed their loved one if they turned them into the police.

What I was saying is that I know in the mindset I *was* in before I got clean I would have blamed my mother and from everyone I've talked to.. any from everything I've read... spending years in prison doesnt make you less likely to commit more crimes in the future.

Do I have an answer for Jacksmom and yourself as to how to get your children clean? No. I don't believe it's possible to 'get someone clean' I think it is only possible for them to get them clean... Though I do believe that you providing an atmosphere in which recovery is more likely definitly has a major impact on when someone chooses to become sober. And sometimes yes.. I know that the atmosphere that is right for an addict is jail.

Have I seen my child’s face bleed for three days because he was beaten by three men in the free meth world? No. I have no children but I have very clear memories of having men kick the door in at a house I was at because they wanted to kill me. I also have very clear memory of the window of a car I was in being shot out by someone who was aiming for us- not the window.

Have you seen your child’s dreams disappear and turn to shyt? No. I have no children but I have very clear memories of dropping out of college the first time, leaving my job behind.. and then ten months later dropping out of college again, getting a long and diverse criminal record and damaging my brain via meth baddly enough that now that I'm clean I struggle for the motivation to get out of bed each morning.

Do you think there is any hope for a meth addict to get into long term recovery without any suffering? No. Meth addiction *is* suffering. Withdrawl is suffering. LIFE is suffering. I really don't have much else to say about this because I think you asked this question because you were angry... because we both know the answer to this qustion.

I am in no way trying to make myself out to be the victim. I'm only trying to demonstrate that I think you and I are on the same page when it comes to what meth use means and the realities of that world.

Honestly... I will never advocate involving the law when your loved one is not in your home and is not committing any crime that effects you or that you witness. I will fully admit that this is likely an artifact of my time using and the 'values' that I lived by then... after all, I was almost killed because someone spread a rumour that I was a snitch... So maybe I'm wrong but that is how I feel. But no... I judge nobody who is involved in these situations. There is no simple right answer when it comes to meth.

I do think that the moment a loved one steals from you.. the moment that they bring that life into your home, the moment they use your house to support their habit even if this just means coming home to eat and sleep.. involving the law is a perfectly acceptable choice.

Let me explain to you my situation so that you understand my reasoning when it comes specifically to me and my addiction. I didnt come to my mom's house. I didnt ask her for money. I didnt ask her for *anything*. She had no idea where I was or even if I was alive. I loved my mom and because of that I would call her and I told her where she could reach me if there was ever an emergency. She would invite me to my younger brother's performances and I would come because I still loved my familly.

My point is that my life was seperate but more importantly I gave her information about my life for her sake in trust. Had she called the cops and told them to go pick me up at the house I lived at.. They would have arrested the owner of the house who had trusted me to allow me to live there, and me who had trusted her to know some things about my life. When someone gives me the kind of trust it takes to let someone live in your home.. if an action of mine were to violate that trust.. I can't even explain how bad that would have felt.

In this situation where she and I traded trust in eachother to maintain a relationship despite out feelings about the choices I was making... What if she had been the one to violate my trust when I had violated none of her boundaries? Can you tell me that would have been right? For her to decide my fate against my will when the only reason she even had this power was because I trusted her?

I will not draw some very obvious paralels here.. but I feel very strongly that it is not right to decide someone's fate for them when they are not treating you badly.

I dunno... I'm sure my post will get some flames... but I hope that people at least take the time to read what I've said.

I do understand your position and really wish I had never responded to this post since I really added very little except possibly doubt for someone who may be considering calling the cops on their kid.. which in most cases I've heard is completely justified. However.. having responded I will not just have people tear what I said apart without understanding what I wrote. Here are the answers to your questions.. and here I repeat myself saying I think that involving the law in most cases is the right choice.. and often long before more parents do.

I only lived my specific situation.. and so can only give insight from my experience. This is probably why I dont write on this board much anymore... I dont see many places where what I have to say will help.

Spase,
Were you of age when all this was happening with you or were you still a minor? Just curious.

Dear Jacksmom, Will Im glad that the law works for you, but in my daughters case she will be 21 this month and has a paper trail and it hasn't done sh*t for her, nothing. Maybe when she's 21 they will listen, maybe not. They let me down and so did the judges in this town. Guene

I have lived on my own since I was 17.

I started using when I was 17 (after I was living in my own place)... but my mom didnt know untill I was an adult..

And so the time that I was refering all happened when I was an adult.

peace.

I've figured out that you need to be a bit aggressive and up front with your expectations. I've voiced my concerns without 'candy coating' ANYTHING and let everyone I've dealt with that I WILL NOT go away without a fight! I have a lot of respect for the law, (as I mentioned, my mom is recently retired from law enforcement),BUT the law IS supposed to work for and with us and being a taxpayer, I will demand to get the results I am entitled to; and will, in turn, work with them to hopefully wake my daughter up!

I'm finding if you as a parent of a minor are willing to go the extra miles to seek help, they're more willing to give you the time. You just need not be intimidated or unprofessional, (if you know what I mean).

Just a side note: I'm NOT a rich spoiled female I just was taught to seek what means a lot to me...

Spase, you said:
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What I was saying is that I know in the mindset I *was* in before I got clean I would have blamed my mother

Now I understand you better. Taking your quote above into consideration, I assume it implies that after you got clean you would have realized that if your mom turned you in it you would have understood that it was out of love for you and a fear for your life. In your response you mentioned twice that you were in danger of being killed.
Spase’s quote
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I think you asked this question because you were angry...

Your are right Spase I was angry not so much at you but at the possibility that a child would never trust us again because we did something that we hated to do (Turn them into the police) for the possible benefit of our loved one. I kinda got a little rough with you and I apologize. I just do not want to accept the possibility of having another stab in my heart from my loved one.

Space’s quote:
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I'm only trying to demonstrate that I think you and I are on the same page when it comes to what meth use means and the realities of that world

.You are right again, we are on the same page about a lot of things and for that I am relieved. However, we are going to have to agree to disagree on your next quote below:
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Honestly... I will never advocate involving the law when your loved one is not in your home and is not committing any crime that effects you or that you witness

When I turned my son in to the law it was not for committing a crime that effects me it was because I think that his time in jail may give him enough time to clear his head and that HE may decide to get clean. I do not have any confidence that jail alone will help him but it just may serve as a tool for my son to think about his life and maybe stop long enough to listen to God and make the right choices to change his life for the better.

Spase’s quote
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What if she had been the one to violate my trust when I had violated none of her boundaries? Can you tell me that would have been right

No, that would not have been right; but for me there are some things that are more important than being right. A few of those are taking actions based upon love and trying to save someone from having a wretched life or losing their life. Let us assume your mother started using meth, was close to being killed two times, and you did not know if she was dead or alive for a long period of time and she had not violated any of your boundaries. That is the same situation you described between you and your mom but reversed. If you had a chance to get her away from meth for a while with the possibility that she would be better able to assess her life, would you do it? Would a violation of trust keep you from trying to help your loved one? Would rights be more important than your love for your mom?
Spase, now I understand you better and I hope you understand me better. I hope you would consider the point of view I described above concerning trust, rights and love. I hoped I helped you see another point of view for consideration because you helped me see how my son may think about me turning him into the law. It will hurt me if he never trusts me again but you have informed me of a possible outcome that I may have to face. If that occurs I hope you will allow me to seek your help in understanding my son.

Spase, as I have said in my previous post “ I have read a lot of your posts and think that you add a lot to this board” Please do not think that you do not help people. Keep on posting, you really got me to thinking and thank you for informing me about a possible attitude my son may have towards me.

You said something that struck me weird...By picking you up(the law)at a place where you lived would have betrayed the trust you had with the owner of the place and possibly got that person in trouble also, how does that change the fact that you obviously weren't honest with that person either, or they would not have allowed you to live there. What you said basically was you would have gotten someone involved that didn't need to be.....you should have thought about that b4 you involved them....Yes very unfair....Guess if you want honest and trustworthy relationships you shouldn't use meth......I don't believe straight people should have any regard for how the lives of addicts are complicated, as the one said, we call on the drug addict not the person we love and trust...And since they have little regard for those that love them, why should they not be treated the same...

For sdmsanjose:

I completely understand you disagreeing where you do with me when it comes to involving law enforcement. And really, I wouldnt even say I disagree with you.. I just know that who I am right now cannot call the cops. It isnt an intelectual choice so much as just how I feel. The only way I can explain that feeling is by saying I have permanent nerve damage in my right hand from the last time I was in cuffs. I had hundreds of dollars of mine stolen by police officers last time I was arrested. They took something like $500, they booked $217 into evidence. They took hundreds of dollars in property that I have listed on the evidence sheet.. that when I went to pick up they told me was "lost." I had to prove many times I was not a snitch.. and was accused of being a cop enough that it's still a very deeply ingrained feeling in me that you NEVER call the cops even though I know that's stupid.

I'm not saying people shouldn't. I'm just saying I know I couldn't.

What if it was my mother who was in the position I was in at the time? I honestly don't know what I would do. I would probably try to 'save' her like so many loved ones here do even though I know it wouldnt be possible. I have no idea.. I havnt had to learn this nightmare from that end and I am thankfull for that.

And lastly I wanted to say... I really really hope your son doesnt bear you that attitude. I know it isnt fair.. meth addiction isnt and I wish it were possible to just beat some sense into addicts sometimes.. I don't have kids but I've watched alot of friends fall apart. I've watched alot of people I knew well fall out of recovery.. and it sucks. I've had long heart to hearts with people I cared about telling them they needed to get their lives togather before it all came apart.. watched them smile and nod and just keep going the way they were going.

I understand where you are coming from I think..

I also think that when your son gets sober.. and really realizes that life is something he doesnt want for himself anymore... that he won't blame you for what you did. I think he will be happy to have a father who is there for him and really loves him and who hasn't given up on his son even if he has accepted that he can't fix all his problems.

I have alot of respect for you..

For Melmav:

The person I was living with knew I was using and knew exactly what I was doing.

It's interesting how you say users have so little regard for the people who love them. I agree in many cases you are right.. in this specific case though the only reason she had the ability to turn me in was because I *did* have regard for her feelings. Her breaching that trust would in fact have taught me that having regard for her feelings was a bad choice since she was unable to honor that trust.

I'm not going to keep going on this subject... it really is very long.. and so much of it is inevitably flavored by our own experiences of what is true.